O2eliminator and constant or snatchy throttle - Suzuki GSXS1000 Forum
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post #1 of 23 Old 02-11-2016, 02:45 PM Thread Starter
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O2eliminator and constant or snatchy throttle

I noted that the PCV installation requires the exclusion of the O2 sensor.
it's replaced by the O2 eliminator that tells to the ECU that the A/F ratio is ok.
This prevents ECU to provide a leaner A/F ratio, due to the PCV .
It also prevents that ECU goes in recovery mode.

The question is:
Has someone tested or knows what happens installing only the O2 eliminator without PCV?

May be that the throttle problem will disappear?
Can this test damage something (engine, sensor...)?

Please, answer only if you have tested on gsxs1000
because the behaviour of the ECU may change with different ECU models.
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post #2 of 23 Old 02-12-2016, 04:31 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by gsxs1000owner View Post
Has someone tested or knows what happens installing only the O2 eliminator without PCV?

Please, answer only if you have tested on gsxs1000
because the behaviour of the ECU may change with different ECU models.
ok, no one has tested it on the gsxs.
have you any other experience about it?
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post #3 of 23 Old 02-13-2016, 05:04 AM
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a standard bike ECU will use the O2 measurement to adjust the air fuel within a narrow band. This can help the bike to deal with temperature variations as well as to some extent variations with the elevation you are using the bike at. I don't really see why eliminating this feedback loop would help much ? Obviously you would want to do this if you use a piggyback solution such as PC5 to avoid the ECU trying to undo the settings you want to add.

Im not sure what the signal the eliminator gives the ECU when installed but i guess there is a chance it would give a signal that could make the mix slightly richer etc. and of course i have no clue if this would help as if this was the case and i have no reason to believe it would be. This would still just make the same curve slightly richer across the range.

In the same idea it could make it more lean across the range or it could do nothing.

what i cant see it doing is change the curve.
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post #4 of 23 Old 02-13-2016, 09:28 AM
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The OP's question is important and not easy to answer.
I would think non-expert ("normal" bike owner) cannot answer this.
It would need disassembling the ECU (bin) to verify the logic for "closed loop" operation.
I have read that some (Bike)ECU have logic to detect that the O2-sensor is "tampered" with and revert to "limp mode"/restricted map. Most likely BMW
I *believe* this probably is not the case for the GSXS.
If the ECU read 14.7AFR from the PC O2-eliminator it will probably do nothing in "closed loop" operation(where the logic in the ECU executes).
*If* there are some logic in other running conditions that takes the AFR as input, then this "idiot sensor bypass device" is a bad solution.
But as Mythic posts above if the OEM O2-sensor is not a quick reacting Wideband sensor then the input is not used for calculating fueling (although I do not think *any* modern engine, even for bikes, uses a "pure" narrow band sensor these days).
Narrow band sensors are also only fairly accurate from a tad over stoich (14.7) to the lean side.
On the rich side it is way off.

It is a matter of mapping the whole area, but only for the TPS/rpm map, using PC.
When we know that this map is different depending on which gear is used and that there are maps also for IAP in the ECU, the use of PC is sort of a good compromise.

Personally these days I think a good remap on the OEM ECU done by a skilled tuner will give just as much (or even more) that using a PC/Bazzazz device.
But this takes more time and needs access to ECU.
This is why PC/Bazzazz and similar are good products to accomplish whatever desired for your bike to a much lower cost.

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post #5 of 23 Old 02-14-2016, 11:24 AM Thread Starter
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The main problem that I want to solve is the intermittent throttle at 2500/3000 rpm. it's in the range of closed loop control of the ECU.
We know that in that range the ECU has to provide an A/F ratio for maximum CAT performance.The setting for smoother performance may be a richer A/F.

The O2 sensor provide a signal oscillating between 100mV (lean) and 900mV (rich).
Disconnecting the sensor we have 0mV and the ECU reports a failure.
I suppose that the O2 eliminator is simply a couple of resistors that give the ECU
a signal near 500mV (the mean between 100 and 900).

The idea may be to tell the ECU "hey, A/F is lean" giving it a lower value than the signal provided directly from the O2 sensor (for example 300mV instead of 400) partitioning it, so the ECU enrich the A/F ratio.

Has anyone tested something similar?
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post #6 of 23 Old 02-14-2016, 12:17 PM
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only the o2 eli. will not bring what u want
new ecu flash is the way , even better than pc5/bazzaz/rapidbike

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post #7 of 23 Old 02-14-2016, 04:19 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsxs1000owner View Post
Has anyone tested something similar?
This is the question.
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post #8 of 23 Old 02-14-2016, 04:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghostrider.1127 View Post
only the o2 eli. will not bring what u want
new ecu flash is the way , even better than pc5/bazzaz/rapidbike
I agree, ECU remap is the best way, I have smooth throttle throughout the rev range
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post #9 of 23 Old 02-14-2016, 04:37 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Zak View Post
I agree, ECU remap is the best way, I have smooth throttle throughout the rev range
I know you are right.
May you tell me who did the job and how much it costs?

If the idea of partitioning the signal from O2 sensor with two resistors is right
we solve the problem with few cents.

Last edited by gsxs1000owner; 02-14-2016 at 05:02 PM.
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post #10 of 23 Old 02-14-2016, 06:41 PM
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I manufactured a throtle friction device for mine .Whilst it doesn't keep the throttle open it does offer resistance to movement /turning and effectively damps the throttle response by isolating it somewhat from rapid transactions such as occur when riding over bumpy ground. This has made the bike far more managable
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