About to order a GT+, have a couple of basic questions

3172 Views 67 Replies 13 Participants Last post by Horgh, 16 d ago

Horgh

Discussion Starter · 2 mo ago (Edited)

Hey all,

After much deliberation I'm pretty ready to order a '23 GT+ in that gorgeous Triton Blue. I haven't even seen one in person because they're unobtainium where I live, but apparently an order can get me one in a few months. I've watched dozens of YouTube reviews and related videos, researched a bunch and even spoke to Chris Moore. With all that, I have a few questions for you existing owners.

1. Every review complains about the weak brakes. Replacing pads is easy, so I assume that's a given. What about replacing the rubber lines with braided ones? Does anyone even make a kit for the GT? What about replacing the master cylinder with a radial one? I ask since I like good brakes and I also plan on getting aftermarket levers, so if I need to replace the master cylinder, I'd like to get that first so I don't have to buy two brake levers.

2. Is a service manual available for this bike? For example, I'd want to know how to properly bleed the brakes after a brake line replacement given the ABS system.

3. Is there a cross-reference anywhere, or a general overview, of what parts are compatible between the GSX-S1000 and the GT models? And what year(s)? It seems like the GT is not called out specifically on a lot of manufacturer's websites, but the base GSX-S1000 is.

4. Does anyone make an aftermarket air filter for the GT? Doesn't seem like it. It's weird that this bike seems to be so unsupported. Is it just too new still?

5. I'm going to want a full exhaust. Looks like M4 is an option but pretty loud, though the Q3 DB killer may help. I'd need to talk to Moore about the tune with that pipe and DB killer. Looks like Dominator out of Poland is another option (I'm Polish). Sounds like Lextek is coming out with a full system too, but I despise FB snobs. I'm also leaving out Brock's because they don't officially have a GT system AND I think they're all pretty loud. I like loud, but I want to have the option to make it less loud for longer trips (DB insert), or just go with a not-too-loud muffler to begin with. Am I missing any other options? I would love to see a full Yoshi system for this bike, that's the classic combo after all.

6. Some people say this bike vibrates a lot, others say it doesn't vibrate much at all. I'm a bit vibration sensitive in the feet, so is there a general consensus?

Thanks all, hopefully none of these will be a deal breaker. I already plan on replacing the tires right away, getting a tail tidy, probably a shorter windscreen (it's hot where I live), and maybe a better seat (if anyone makes one). I realize this is a "budget" bike but I fell in love with the looks and I've always wanted a high RPM inline four

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CaptainSlow

· #21 · 2 mo ago

LOL squeezing the lever with the stock pads will get the abs intervention nearly instantly, so I'm not sure how much of a difference better pads will make. What kind of improvement in stopping distance do you really think better pads will provide?

triplethreat

· #22 · 2 mo ago

CaptainSlow said:
LOL squeezing the lever with the stock pads will get the abs intervention nearly instantly, so I'm not sure how much of a difference better pads will make. What kind of improvement in stopping distance do you really think better pads will provide?

I've provided factual information above, you've provided conjecture and your own personal thoughts and feelings about the brakes.

speeddragon

· #23 · 2 mo ago

triplethreat said:
You are stating what you think/believe, ....not facts. Here are the facts. Getting a vehicle stopped from a given speed involves several factors. The mass or weight of the vehicle, the reaction time between perceived danger and the actual time that the brakes are being applied, and of course the actual braking power of the device that is doing the braking. The coefficient of friction of the pad material on the rotors, in the case of our motorcycles, plays a significant part in the effect of slowing the motorcycle down. So let's say that the motorcycle's mass is the same with two different bikes. Let's also say that the two bikes are traveling at the same exact speed....60mph. At 60 mph, the two motorcycles will travel 88' in exactly one second of time. Let's say that both riders start applying the brakes at the same instant of time. One of the bikes has the OEM pads that has a coefficient of friction of XXX amount. The other bike has pads that have a higher coefficient of friction...by some amount more than the OEM pads. So if both bikes weigh the same, both bikes are traveling at the exact same speed, both riders apply the brakes at the same exact time......which bike will start slowing down at a faster rate of time. And remember, both bikes are moving at 88' per second at the instant the brakes are applied, so the faster that you can reduce that 88' per second of travel time, the more quickly one of the bikes will stop. Do you think it will be the bike with the OEM pads and a lower coefficient of friction??? Or do you follow common sense and say that it will be the bike with the pads that have a HIGHER coeffficient of friction pads. Just as an arbitrary number, let's say the bike with the OEM pads travels 15 feet further before it comes to a complete stop. What if that 15' of extra travel is just the distance need that causes you to hit the side of the car that pulled out in front of you.....or the deer that darted across the road....or maybe the difference between getting the bike stopped or going over the side of the mountain up in the twisties. Yea, we aren't talking miles of difference here, but we are talking some unknow distance, and that distance might just be the distance that saves you from being in an accident. And THAT ^^^^^ is the Facts

Having said all of that, when both bikes get to the point in time that the brakes are being applied hard enough to cause the ABS to intervene, then it's pretty much a moot point regarding the coefficient of friction of the pads, and more a determining factor of the ABS intervention. Where the difference lies, is in the initial bite of the brakes and their ability to get to the ABS intervention point of time, and the difference of speed reduction, thus overall stopping distance, of the bike with the better brake pads. It's a known fact that a bike with ABS will normally not stop as quickly as a bike without it. So why not take advantage of of getting that initial rate of speed reduced more quickly with better pads and create a shorter stopping distance?

Great. Logical explanation with facts.

Horgh

Discussion Starter · #24 · 2 mo ago

Fellas, I really appreciate all of the replies, both to my questions and otherwise. But I'm the new guy here, I don't want to cause bad blood between existing members. At the end of the day, we all take the same risks when we throw a leg over a motorbike, and that should be a uniting factor.

So... what motor oil are y'all using?

I'm kidding

triplethreat

· #25 · 2 mo ago

Horgh said:
Fellas, I really appreciate all of the replies, both to my questions and otherwise. But I'm the new guy here, I don't want to cause bad blood between existing members. At the end of the day, we all take the same risks when we throw a leg over a motorbike, and that should be a uniting factor.

So... what motor oil are y'all using?

I'm kidding

Wait......What.....These motors need OIL?????

Seriously though, YOU are in no way responsible for the discussion between myself and CaptainSlow. He made some comments that I disagreed with and I responded with some factual information instead of opinion and personal beliefs. It's all good, and let's face it, questions like that, along with the ever popular motor oil question come up sometimes. I am not, and pretty much have never been one to let bad information go unanswered.....if I know it's wrong AND if I have the knowledge to comment on it.

Reactions: 2

Horgh

Discussion Starter · #26 · 2 mo ago

Fair enough

I'm happy to report that I placed the order this morning for a '23 GT+. Delivery is estimated for June, so who knows when I'll actually see it.

I'm going to have Dunlop Roadsmart 4s put on before I even take delivery of the bike, and I think I'm going to order the Dominator exhaust from Poland. Once I have it installed, I'll take a road trip to Moore Mafia for tuning. I'm pretty excited.

Reactions: 1

triplethreat

· #27 · 2 mo ago

Horgh said:
Fair enough

I'm happy to report that I placed the order this morning for a '23 GT+. Delivery is estimated for June, so who knows when I'll actually see it.

I'm going to have Dunlop Roadsmart 4s put on before I even take delivery of the bike, and I think I'm going to order the Dominator exhaust from Poland. Once I have it installed, I'll take a road trip to Moore Mafia for tuning. I'm pretty excited.

Well, a HUGE Congratulations to you... That's awesome. When I bought my FZ09, I waited about 6 weeks from deposit paid to arrival and it drove me crazy. Hopefully it will be earlier than they think

Reactions: 1

FreePenguiny

· #28 · 2 mo ago

I waited something like 6 months. lol. enjoy your bike!

Reactions: 1

triplethreat

· #29 · 2 mo ago

FreePenguiny said:
I waited something like 6 months. lol. enjoy your bike!

There is an old saying about Patience is a virtue, which probably is true, but I'm guessing that whoever came up with that phrase.....WAS NOT a motorcyclist!

Reactions: 3

LanghamP

· #30 · 2 mo ago

I believe hose failure is the number one cause of fatal motorcycle wrecks excluding rider error. Suzuki manual does state to replace hoses after 4 years. I personally don't but I inspect my bike darn near after every ride. I had a brake failure from a damaged hose, and that incident makes my hair stand on end.

Outside of brake hose replacement and upgraded suspension/tires and...maybe...brake pad replacement, I believe most riders best serve their own interest by keeping their bike reliably stock instead of unreliably aftermarket. Mods are much more likely to result in a breakdown, and when it comes to being a good rider then seat time is everything. You'll have these insanely modified bikes with...3500 miles on them. Instead of spending money on mods, just put in quality seat time on twisty roads, the occasional track day, and commuting in any and all weather. And with ABS/TC, these bikes are fantastic all-weather vehicles.

And if you insists on spending money on your new bike, the first should simply be an ABBA stand.

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Horgh

Discussion Starter · #31 · 2 mo ago

LanghamP said:
I believe hose failure is the number one cause of fatal motorcycle wrecks excluding rider error. Suzuki manual does state to replace hoses after 4 years. I personally don't but I inspect my bike darn near after every ride. I had a brake failure from a damaged hose, and that incident makes my hair stand on end.

Outside of brake hose replacement and upgraded suspension/tires and...maybe...brake pad replacement, I believe most riders best serve their own interest by keeping their bike reliably stock instead of unreliably aftermarket. Mods are much more likely to result in a breakdown, and when it comes to being a good rider then seat time is everything. You'll have these insanely modified bikes with...3500 miles on them. Instead of spending money on mods, just put in quality seat time on twisty roads, the occasional track day, and commuting in any and all weather. And with ABS/TC, these bikes are fantastic all-weather vehicles.

And if you insists on spending money on your new bike, the first should simply be an ABBA stand.

I don't have the statistics on hose failures, but that claims seems a little far-fetched. I would argue that other drivers doing stupid crap is probably ranked pretty high as far as biker deaths go. But maybe I'm wrong, I'd love to see the numbers. Rubber hoses always have a shelf life, but braided hoses still have rubber in them, so they too need changing.

I also don't think it's fair to say that stock reliability is better than aftermarket. Off the top of my head, the still-not-fixed KLR doohickey problem, or the KTM Adventure line airbox leaking problem, I'm sure there are many more. If you buy quality aftermarket parts and not eBay junk, they'll last just as long, if not longer, and probably work better. Don't forget that these big manufactures cut costs where they can.

I haven't heard of the abba stand before, looks interesting, but also really gimmicky. I already have three Pitbull stands: front caliper / steering stem, rear swingarm spool, as well as single-sided swingarm (for my Speed Triple). They work pretty well and I can get the entire bike off the ground to remove both wheels without much hassle. I also live 30 minutes from Pitbull's headquarters, so I have full in-person product support as needed.

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triplethreat

· #32 · 2 mo ago

LanghamP said:
I believe hose failure is the number one cause of fatal motorcycle wrecks excluding rider error. Suzuki manual does state to replace hoses after 4 years. I personally don't but I inspect my bike darn near after every ride. I had a brake failure from a damaged hose, and that incident makes my hair stand on end.

Outside of brake hose replacement and upgraded suspension/tires and...maybe...brake pad replacement, I believe most riders best serve their own interest by keeping their bike reliably stock instead of unreliably aftermarket. Mods are much more likely to result in a breakdown, and when it comes to being a good rider then seat time is everything. You'll have these insanely modified bikes with...3500 miles on them. Instead of spending money on mods, just put in quality seat time on twisty roads, the occasional track day, and commuting in any and all weather. And with ABS/TC, these bikes are fantastic all-weather vehicles.

And if you insists on spending money on your new bike, the first should simply be an ABBA stand.

Care to share why YOU believe that hose failure is the #1 cause of fatal motorcycle wrecks (excluding rider error) and what is your source of information on that......or that just some random though that you had?

gpounce

· #33 · 2 mo ago (Edited)

I've had relatively poorly performing brake hoses- but they still worked and were nowhere near failure. And ridden one bike with 20+ yr old OEM brake lines which performed just fine. My close calls and wrecks were due to my errors, not technical shortcomings of the bike.

I have helped recover bikes from the side of the road, stranded through lack of maintenance- with and without aftermarket mods. The worst one was a 72 vintage Sportster- an unbelievable hybrid of various ancient parts- which was stuck because the front tire went flat. While I had the bike I overhauled the brakes, steering head bearings, and a triple tree pinch bolt that sheared as soon as I tried to loosen it. That sheared bolt was a critical risk, and was OEM. That and the steering head were issues, again, because none of the bike's owners did any maintenance on them for 50 years. The brakes were still working and the current owner had changed some of the fluid- but the sender unit and speedo cable were nearly dry of lubrication and packed with dirt- another risk item- and were OEM.

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triplethreat

· #34 · 2 mo ago

gpounce said:
I've had relatively poorly performing brake hoses- but they still worked and were nowhere near failure. And ridden one bike with 20+ yr old OEM brake lines which performed just fine. My close calls and wrecks were due to my errors, not technical shortcomings of the bike. I have helped recover bikes from the side of the road, stranded through lack of maintenance- with and without aftermarket mods.

I agree with your comments and I'll just add this. I've been riding motorcycles for 52 years (the 2023 GT+ is bike number 29 for me) and I have NEVER, EVER, not even one time had a brake failure.

LanghamP

· #35 · 2 mo ago

Horgh said:
I don't have the statistics on hose failures, but that claims seems a little far-fetched. I would argue that other drivers doing stupid crap is probably ranked pretty high as far as biker deaths go. But maybe I'm wrong, I'd love to see the numbers. Rubber hoses always have a shelf life, but braided hoses still have rubber in them, so they too need changing.

--snip
I believe hose failure is the number one cause of fatal motorcycle wrecks excluding rider error.
--end snip

DanDan the Fireman specified upward to 90% of bike crashes are from the rider putting his bike into a driver's car while the rider is speeding. I've seen figures as high as 97% for fatal bike crashes but I'm skeptical of those because the dead rider didn't get to tell his side of the story.

LanghamP

· #36 · 2 mo ago

triplethreat said:
Care to share why YOU believe that hose failure is the #1 cause of fatal motorcycle wrecks (excluding rider error) and what is your source of information on that......or that just some random though that you had?

Actually I was incorrect; tire punctures are the number 1 cause of motorcycle deaths due to mechanical failure, with hose failure the second most common cause of death. But, hey, it's been four years since I last saw that video.

Curiously, I've had brake failure in the way FortNine describes; a rock from a leading rider cut my brake hose.

I believe these are the most to least likely to fail, but at some point badly-maintained bikes will fail. I've had the first two failures over 35+ years of riding.
1. Tire failure.
2. Hose failure.
3. Chain.
4. Geometry.
5. Wheel bearing.
6. Headlamp failure.

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LanghamP

· #37 · 2 mo ago

triplethreat said:
I agree with your comments and I'll just add this. I've been riding motorcycles for 52 years (the 2023 GT+ is bike number 29 for me) and I have NEVER, EVER, not even one time had a brake failure.

I've had a brake hose fail on me when the rider in front threw up a rock that nicked the brake hose. It makes my hair stand on end thinking about all the bad ways that could have ended as we were on Highway 1 north of SF. Newish bike too, at around 2 years old.

triplethreat

· #38 · 2 mo ago

LanghamP said:
I've had a brake hose fail on me when the rider in front threw up a rock that nicked the brake hose. It makes my hair stand on end thinking about all the bad ways that could have ended as we were on Highway 1 north of SF. Newish bike too, at around 2 years old.

I guess I'm lucky then....52 years of riding and never a failure like that. I believe I'll just knock on some wood and hope the winning streak continues, although it likely will NOT be for another 52 years

gpounce

· #39 · 2 mo ago

Cut/damaged brake line would be scary AF... haven't had that happen but I have run into a bird with my helmet so who knows. I have had a rear flat at speed on the highway, which is quite a suprise, thankfully while crusing and not mixing it up traffic.

LanghamP

· #40 · 2 mo ago

triplethreat said:
I guess I'm lucky then....52 years of riding and never a failure like that. I believe I'll just knock on some wood and hope the winning streak continues, although it likely will NOT be for another 52 years

It was one of the times I truly felt endangered on a motorcycle. I went to pull the brakes on a blind and sharp right hand turn, with a (very smallish) cliff on the left hand side, and there wasn't anything there. I leaned it way over, touched my pipe headers to the ground, went into the other lane, and it was a keep leaning situation until I brought it back. The two guys behind me said it looked like I fell off the edge of the tires.

I was so frazzled that the very next turn that was coming up in about 1.5 seconds I also went into the next lane but nowhere near the lean angle from trying to figure out what just happened. So two blown turns. Lucky lucky, and a lot of those previous turns were way faster.

I bought braided steel brakes immediately afterwards. I think if you ride with others, even occasionally, then braided brake lines and a radiator guard are pretty important.

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