GSXS 1000 Forum banner

1 - 20 of 27 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
100 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Just went to a bike shop and it's quite a good one guy used to race himself and he said that reflashing your ECU is a gimmick and know good there are better options . Please give me your opinions on this as I've believed that reflashing is better ,well Paul reckons anyway in one of his videos . Cheers ..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
719 Posts
To say a flash is a gimmick versus a power commander it's just wrong... they are either both gimmics or just different approaches..... Anyone with any bike knowledge would know the difference.

No need to explain why since it is discussed extensively elsewhere in the forum.

Does he sell power commander and not do the ECU flash?.... that would explain a lot
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
100 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
dqban , your bang on right he is just trying to sell the power commander and doesn't do reflash . You just can't trust any of these bike shop it drives me mad , wish I had the knowledge and experience to do these things myself or someone I could trust . A reflash is only for diesel engines hahaha where his words , what a joke .
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
694 Posts
Flash can change everything that you want changed, all a pc does is cost more and do things less to a less precise. Piggy backs just can’t do what a direct flash can do.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
554 Posts
My dyno guy who tuned my race bikes said the same thing and he is a authorized FTECU dealer. He prefers PCV5 tuned on a dyno along with the flash to turn the appropriate things off in the ECU. I didn't go that route on my GSX and regret it daily, basically every time I ride the GSX. My flash is the FTECU mail in route, it is not that good even after a redo.

Problem is I cannot just send my ECU to anyone now as it is locked by FTECU.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
694 Posts
From what I’ve read, race tuning is awful for streetability. Sorry to hear that, he can’t reset it back to stock? Why not? I figure stock would unlock for others.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
554 Posts
From what I’ve read, race tuning is awful for streetability. Sorry to hear that, he can’t reset it back to stock? Why not? I figure stock would unlock for others.
He didn't do the flash I sent it to FTECU in Cali. My tuner guy won't do a counter flash, says it's not the way to do it right. FTECU locks the ECU when you mail it in to them.

Bike runs great above 2500 rpm anything under that its a pos imo. I have voiced my opinion to FTECU about it many times over the phone. They're clueless and cover them selves by telling me its a race tune. I replied fine but I could not ride this pos across the paddock to the grid like this with the chain snatching it does and jugging below 2500 rpms in any gear. I got no response from them on it other than it is the suzuki anti stall circuit causing the problem on their flash. I'll go ahead and throw the BS flag on that one too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
95 Posts
He didn't do the flash I sent it to FTECU in Cali. My tuner guy won't do a counter flash, says it's not the way to do it right. FTECU locks the ECU when you mail it in to them.

Bike runs great above 2500 rpm anything under that its a pos imo. I have voiced my opinion to FTECU about it many times over the phone. They're clueless and cover them selves by telling me its a race tune. I replied fine but I could not ride this pos across the paddock to the grid like this with the chain snatching it does and jugging below 2500 rpms in any gear. I got no response from them on it other than it is the suzuki anti stall circuit causing the problem on their flash. I'll go ahead and throw the BS flag on that one too.
Reach out to Danos and see what he would recommend. That seems mental that they can't flash it back to stock and unlock it. Every tuner I ever used was only locked while the flash was on the ECU. (They were for cars, but I have to imagine its the same)
Everyone on the forum seems really please with what Dano's has done to their ECU.

[email protected]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
719 Posts
I have danos also....not bad.

One big advantage power commander has is their dynos and tuning set up....they are everywhere and they have a pretty refined dyno tuning software and system.
Not uncommon at all to run both flash and pc5.
PC is not bad but, doesnt typically fix the things that irk sport bike riders.

Really wish suzuki would let us adjust these things ourselves to some degree...relsease some APIs for their ecu or something.

I love that engine braking is becomming a common adjustable feature


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
143 Posts
What i suggest is a basic flash, which consists of removing restrictions like fuel cut, secondary butterflies closing, topspeed limit removal ,switching off errors, top speed etc so the bike runs properly as a base setup

and leave the fueling and powering up with power commander, it s much easier and we can make adjustments as many times as we want.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
100 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Yes I agree , I've spent the last couple of days researching this power commander Vs reflash thing and I'm not at all technically minded when it comes to bikes ( it's all new to me ) but from what I can pick up reflash is your best option and add pcv to do fueling.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
429 Posts
I had my bike flashed but the tuner would not just flash without the bike going on the dyno.
My bike is stock 153.9 hp dyno numbers after the flash.
The dyno tuner did mention to me that some get their bikes flashed plus pc5 but he seemed to think it’s a waste of time unless you race.
My bike is really smooth and goes heaps better than it did before.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
326 Posts
Realllly ? you say it’s a good idea to get a reflash to remove the top speed restrictions and secondary butterfly’s to stay shut

And you get a PCV to help it not run so lean? Well I have a power commander 5 I got it just for the tweaky throttle, works great, but now I’m wondering if I should get a reflash on it as well if it’d actually open up the bike more and help it breath, waiting on headers is my only issue or id of had a dyno tune done a while ago


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
554 Posts
Well I am in the FTECU locked my ecu boat with mine. Can't get anyone else to fix their mess short of sending it back to FTECU which I hate the thought of doing or buy a used ECU and take a chance it'll even work in my bike. I remember when Suzuki replaced my ECU early on and sent the ABS bike ECU it wouldn't work in my non-ABS bike.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
694 Posts
I had my bike flashed but the tuner would not just flash without the bike going on the dyno.
My bike is stock 153.9 hp dyno numbers after the flash.
The dyno tuner did mention to me that some get their bikes flashed plus pc5 but he seemed to think it’s a waste of time unless you race.
My bike is really smooth and goes heaps better than it did before.


I don't understand this though. the ECU can be flashed on a dyno into the system itself, its perform faster, more precise etc. the piggyback is just that a piggyback, the ecu has superior tenability in every way. why not have them just dyno flash it? or does he not have the ability would be my guess. PC is probably easier to tune but doesn't make it better

if you can get same tune on either pc5 and ecu, id go tune into ecu all day. plus, takes space and I love my trunk space.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
What i suggest is a basic flash, which consists of removing restrictions like fuel cut, secondary butterflies closing, topspeed limit removal ,switching off errors, top speed etc so the bike runs properly as a base setup

and leave the fueling and powering up with power commander, it s much easier and we can make adjustments as many times as we want.

I agree...Each time you want to change a map on the ECU you need to switch off the ignition and flash the ECU which takes a few minutes and there is a very small risk that you can brick your ECU, unlikely but it's a risk. A PC5 fuel map can be changed quicker and therefore takes less time to fine tune.



However, a PC5 can't change iginiton timing maps, exhaust valve maps (if you still have it fitted) and all as mentioned in above quote.



If you want total control you go with both.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
891 Posts
The PC5 takes input signals from the ECU and changes them as they go to the bike. It's basically an intercept and transmit box. The flash has all the granularity of a PC5 if not more. You can adjust fueling on a cylinder by cylinder basis. Ignition mapping by gear per cylinder. I fail to see how the flash is a gimmick when you are able to directly manipulate the actual software running the bike rather than something that intercepts the signal and changes it.

Bottom line is that PowerCommander had a hold on the market for so long that tuners are heavily invested in their dyno hardware and software which is designed for PowerCommander hardware and likely also can get some markup selling PowerCommander hardware. Not to mention probably having an investment in licensing to be an "Officially licensed power commander tuner."

As far as speed to flash, yes, maybe the Power Commander is faster. However, it only takes a couple of minutes to flash the ECU so that's pretty negligible. When it comes to professional tuners, I guess it really depends on your area, but there's at least two FTECU tuners in the Dallas/Ft Worth area so maybe we are lucky.

I've a long history with PowerCommander hardware and currently have one on my Yamaha FJR. But, they have their problems too. I remember the one for the Suzuki TLR that was touted to have ignition timing. There were issues with that PC3 that would make the bike unrideable and the solution was to send it in and they'd fix it, by disabling the ignition timing module in the PC3. Of course, to me the biggest advantage of a PowerCommander is that when you sell your bike you can simply remove it and the bike is back to stock and you can sell the PC5 separately and put some money back in your pocket. None of that matters to me, I'm keeping this bike either forever or until it's not really worth anything anymore.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
583 Posts
Just went to a bike shop and it's quite a good one guy used to race himself and he said that reflashing your ECU is a gimmick and "no good"; there are better options . Please give me your opinions on this as I've believed that reflashing is better ,well Paul reckons anyway in one of his videos . Cheers ..
Your profile doesn't say where you are from SO that makes it trickier. Might want to add that to your profile so people know your location so they can offer pertinent advice. You signed off with "Cheers" that leads me to believe you are in Great Britain, Australia, or New Zealand. If that's the case, those of us advising you to send your ECU to Dano's Performance in California (USA) isn't really going to do it for you.


First off, WHY do you want to mess with your bike's fueling? Is is abrupt? Not running right? Or are you just looking for more power?


Getting the ECU reflashed is the "best" quick/cheap fix, but the right shop has to do it. In the USA, that's Dano's. For your location...I don't know. The Power Commander V used to be the only way people could 'mess' with their bikes. Now that ECU flashing is a 'thing', you have better control and you aren't "adding" anything to the bike (PC-V has to be plugged into your wiring harness.) With a PC-V, you could load 'general' maps, or you could put it on a dyno and get a custom map. That works well, but between the PC-V and the dyno time, you will be out a lot of money ($500 or more).


To put that into perspective, you can get your ECU flashed by Dano's Performance for $180 and - if something changes on your bike later (like you add a full-on exhaust system) he will generally "re-flash" for $50 or so (case-by-case basis.)


Only you can decide what is 'right' for you, but the guy you spoke to who told you FLASHING ECUs was a 'gimmick' seems dishonest to me. Not a gimmick. Works for thousands of riders. Cheap. Effective. Simple. Pull ECU, send it in, get flashed, receive it back, put back on bike and ride. If you were RACING, then perhaps you need a FLASH and a PC-V and some dyno tuning. But you're not racing...are you?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
100 Posts
Discussion Starter #20 (Edited)
I'm putting a full yoshimura system on my bike plus high flow air filter .. I'm from London England .. thanks for any advice . I think by the looks of what I have been reading a reflash is the best option .it is very expensive over here anything from £350 to £500 . That's done on a Dyno and a custom map . I'm not racing just like to mess about and get the best from the bike .👍
 
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
Top